Q & A: Lockheed Martin Australia chief executive, Air Marshal (Retired) Warren McDonald AO, CSC

Phil Tarrant:

Hello everyone, how are you going? Phil Tarrant here, host of the Defence Connect Podcast, I hope you are well. My first trip post lockdown to Canberra, the nation's capital. It's been five to six months in the waiting. It's good to be back on terra firma here where everything is happening. We now know a lot's happened over the last three to four months. The AUKUS arrangement, that's advancing, some challenges in the leadership as we enter the federal election coming up, the mail is early next year. No shortage of scuttlebutt out here in Canberra, we'll be keeping up on it at defenceconnect.com.au.

One of the main changes with one of the big primes, also down here in Canberra, is a new chief executive for Lockheed Martin. Joe North has finished his tenure here. and today I catch up with the new Chief Executive. I think it's his first formal official media interview, Air Marshal Retired, Warren McDonald, AOCSC. We're going to chat things through all Lockheed, F-35 update, a view towards the AUKUS arrangement, what's happening with the FREDA programme and the combat system, plus a whole bunch of other factors. Warren, how are you going, are you well?

Warren McDonald:

Yeah, good, Phil. You pack a lot in the opening speech. I'll try and pick up all those batons as we run around with them.

Phil Tarrant:

This is part of the skill, right, to actually load it up with plenty of things that we can chat about and see where the conversation goes, but congratulations on the new role.

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Warren McDonald:

Thank you very much.

Phil Tarrant:

Feet under the desk, only just there. How's it going so far?

Warren McDonald:

Well, it's a great privilege and a great honour to take over from Joe, who's been exceptional in setting the foundation stones for us to move forward, so I consider myself very fortunate fellow.

Phil Tarrant:

For you, most recently you were heading up Joint Capabilities in the ADF, a bit of a step change, the same but different. How is it so far?

Warren McDonald:

The same but different. I think you've characterised it well. In that role in Defence, it was about bringing everybody together along a joint journey. Lockheed Martin isn't too dissimilar, it's got four large business arms and a technology area as well, and large organisations need to be cohesive so they can be more cogent to their customer and get the right outcomes, and Lockheed Martin is certainly on that journey.

Phil Tarrant:

I was looking through your CV on Wikipedia and I-Tell on the internet, it's well documented and you've got a pretty familiar hands-on experience with the Lockheed business, P-3's, CP-140 Auroras, AP-3C Orions. There's no shortage of getting your hands on Lockheed equipment over the years.

Warren McDonald:

Yeah, and I've been very fortunate to fly the aircraft, so 5,000 hours. It kept me safe and well occupied, and it was a great aircraft and I enjoyed flying it and the capabilities that it brought.

Phil Tarrant:

It must be quite serendipitous thinking that you used to use this equipment and then one day, no doubt you weren't thinking at the time you'd be taking over the stewardship of Lockheed Martin here in Australia.

Warren McDonald:

No, I didn't have that forethought, and people could say that that's been synonymous throughout my life, but I would say I've been indeed, very fortunate. Look, it's got a lot of great capabilities in Lockheed Martin. F-35, Aegis combat systems, missiles and fire control, and really it's focused on technology and that's really important to the modern war fighter. It's a company of 114,000 people, 60,000 of those that are engineers. That gives you the understanding of the balance or the weight that Lockheed Martin puts into advanced technologies, and it's serious about it.

Phil Tarrant:

I know, again, looking at your previous career, you actually started off as an apprentice motor transport fitter.

Warren McDonald:

Yes.

Phil Tarrant:

That's quite an interesting journey, to go through your role into the RAAF, as a commissioned officer and now into Lockheed Martin. What do the guys and girls say about you kicked off your career in the RAAF, now that you're doing this job?

Warren McDonald:

Yeah, look, I still keep in touch with those people that I worked with, over 10 years in that profession. That was more born out of desperation as opposed to inspiration for joining the air force, so desperation on my side to leave school, because I hated it. Desperation on my parents' side to stop me going down a wayward path. 

They won. My mother saw some young apprentices walking through Wagga at the time,  and thought this might be a great way to nip the butt off somebody who was probably all thrust, but no vector, so she signed me up to it basically, sitting across the kitchen table. Thankfully she brought two forms, because I filled one out incorrectly, and here I am today.

It's been a great journey, I've been incredibly fortunate, I wouldn't change a day for anything. Coming out of my family, which had a strong work ethic, it was all about team over individual. I joined the Air Force and it doubled down on team over individual, and that's what I've learned throughout my career in Defence for 41 years. Then when I've come to Lockheed Martin, no surprise, it's about team over individual and about getting the outcomes, and the only way you can do that is with a team.

Phil Tarrant:

Life's all about inflexion points, and tell me about the moment where you went, "Oh, hang on a second, maybe I'll try this pilot training stuff." A different career after a decade of doing what you're doing. What was that trigger?

Warren McDonald:

It was one of my good friends who I went through an apprenticeship course, when I was in RAAF base Butterworth in Malaysia at that time. He said, "Do you want to come down and see a P-3 do an engine night flight?" Which I did. I stepped on board, walked into the cockpit and I thought, "That's it. This is where I want to be." Simple words, I had to translate to night school, I had to translate to writing to the Royal Australian Air Force to ask if I could come back from Malaysia early.

I still have that letter, Phil, and it goes along three lines basically. "I want to be a pilot in the Royal Australian Air Force. Can you please post me back early so I can do my high school certificate in New South Wales?" They wrote back and said, "Yes." A lot of night school, a fair bit of focus and I was lucky enough.

Phil Tarrant:

That's certainly a much longer pathway than most, to try and get going that way. No doubt that resilience is probably what appealed. 

Warren McDonald:

Yes, but that's part of my life. I maybe fairly resilient and do it tougher in some ways, if you want to put it in those terms, not smarter. I'd recommend anyone listening, particularly those in Year 12, finish your Year 12. Because I can tell you, there's two paths, one's got a very steep gradient, they all lead to the same destination, take the one with the lesser gradient.

Phil Tarrant:

It's pretty smart counsel, but here you are Chief Executive of Lockheed Martin, and one of the headline products for them, and also for the Royal Australian Air Force and the RAAF, a fifth generation fighting force is the F-35. You would know about the arrival of the first F-35's which was late 2018 by memory was it? Sorry, it might have been '17, was it?

Warren McDonald:

It was '18.

Phil Tarrant:

Yeah, and now the delivery of this capability continues. Where are we at the F-35 now? How many are in Australia and what's that pathway and pipeline moving forward, and how much of your focus is going to be on ensuring the continuity of that programme?

Warren McDonald:

Yeah, a very strong focus. I think people underestimate just how advanced the F-35 programme is globally, and I'll bring it back down to Australian with context. Over 700 aircraft produced, across nine countries and 29 bases. It's flown over 430,000 hours collective work. Bringing it back to Australia, by the end of the year we'll have 44 aircraft in-country, and on the role to fit out Tindal by the end of next year.

Where we are right now is that Tindal is set, ready to go with contracts in place with local companies, in which Lockheed Martin does invest in, and also all the simulators were put in place months ahead. The Royal Australian Air Force has flown over 13,000 hours, currently. It's trained over 700 maintainers and over 60 pilots. It's currently doing its own F-35 training in-country.

That is a marked step for where we were, and the Royal Australian Air Force is on the march to roll out F-35 capability. I was fortunate enough, two weeks ago, to go up and visit RAAF base Williamtown and go through there. What struck me most, it's that team effort. We've got Lockheed Martin employees embedded inside the squadrons, to support the Royal Australian Air Force, and meeting with the commanding officer of 2-OCU, Operational Conversion Unit, it was very evident it was a team effort, that we were very focused on delivering the outcome for the war fellows.

Phil Tarrant:

Yeah, I think the birth of F-35 is well documented. It wasn't particularly an easy birth, it was quite painful, with a lot of headlines over many years. Though to be fair, the F-35 has been out of the headlines recently, and I think that's probably a good thing and indicative of the fact the programme is now mature in the airframe and it's capabilities is maturing by the day. 

No doubt Lockheed is happy that the focus is not on the myriad of challenges there had been prior, and Defence have been able to be quite vocal in trying to help communicate to maybe those not as informed as what people inside of the fence, just how complicated this particular piece of machinery is.

Warren McDonald:

Yeah, it's a highly technical, highly capable aircraft. Look, you'll always have your pundits who don't agree with that. Nor were the people in full agreement when we went from the Sabre to the Mirage, from the Mirage to the F-18.

The reality is that it's a highly complex piece of equipment that takes time to develop, like any introduction of any new capability. It has matured beyond that point now, and it is robust and it's capable. People now shift their focus to the cost of sustainment, because acquisition costs have come down by 40%.

It's about 79, well, 77 to 79 million per copy for an F-35. That's very, very comparable to a fourth generation aircraft. Go to sustainment, over the last five years, Lockheed Martin's portion of the sustainment cost that it's responsible for, they've driven them down by about 45%. Over the next four to five years, they're on a path to drive it down by another 40%. As the whole fleet grows globally, you'll see a very, very competitive, if not more competitive cost of engine sustainment in a fourth generation aircraft.

Phil Tarrant:

What will be the next big milestones for the F-35? That's setting up Tindal, obviously, the arrival of all the jets eventually, are they just the next two key things we'll hear?

Warren McDonald:

Yeah, Tindal. Making sure the Tindal arrival and upgrade goes well. The focus on that is getting Tindal bedded down. Look, as most listeners would understand, but overseas maybe not, no, Tindal's basically a deployment, that it is in a remote area of Australia, all for the right reasons, and it has challenges associated with it logistically. With support, the Northern Territory government's been exceptional in that, and local industry, to support that aircraft to the best of it's capability.

Phil Tarrant:

How the pilots are finding it, and no doubt you had a yarn with a couple of them while you were up there, in general?

Warren McDonald:

Yeah, it's always good to get an operator's perspective. They find it a game changer, literally a game changer. The situational awareness that's provided to an aviator is quite exceptional. Anyone familiar with an aircraft that's listening, it mine even talk it down to the point, how do you provide the maximum amount of situational awareness or alleviate the aviator from thinking about anything apart from the mission?

A good example would be when you select the landing gear, it looks after the flaps. You don't need to look after it, it will look after itself. You extend that type of thinking deep into the mission system that it provides, it gives you some understanding of what processes the Lockheed gives it.

Phil Tarrant:

Yeah, your time in the RAAF, now you're at the helm of Lockheed Martin, however, you probably still get that inside view, what's the approach to, or the thoughts of those operators of this fifth generation fighting force? We're talking the 100 year anniversary of the RAAF right now, it's a step change and I know the eyes of the world is looking at how the RAAF goes about doing this for a small air force, but highly capable and technical. Are they talking on that same language, or is it just, we just get the job done?

Warren McDonald:

They're talking that language. When you talk to the operators, they're well advanced in their thinking, as you'd imagine, smart people. You look where the Air Force has come, and indeed all the services are over 100 years. It is quite stark to where we are now, and where we are now is a complex world and a complex world requires deep analytical thinking.

I look at it as the Air Force has developed into, out of a single service, into a joint approached service, as has the Army and Navy. You have to, modern warfare forces that. Then you start looking at, as an air force, as a navy, an army, what do you bring best to the fight? That best to the fight is a joint approach with the cultural nett standards and norms you have inside your organisation, to maximise and leverage your equipment.

It's an evolution, Phil, and it'll continue to be that way, and thankfully for the young people we have inside the Defence Force and indeed industry supporting, they'll get the best out of that.

Phil Tarrant:

Certainly, no doubt, echoing your final role in uniform, in your Chief of Joint Capabilities, when you went into that role and then when you exited that role, you must have had some assumptions going into it, which were quickly disproven once you got into the role, what would they be?

Warren McDonald:

Look, the test of whether someone's really going to work with you or not, is will they give up people, will they give up money for a common cause which is bigger than themselves? The biggest fight you ever got was people, because people can make a lot of things happen. That was the initial struggle going in, along with the joining up. Because you are pulling on the services, you do demand requirements. 

To be fair, they have a focus of their own, and rightly so, to provide a combat power at the will of the government. It was the leadership from the Chief of Defence Force, General Campbell and the Secretary of Defence, Secretary Mario, who set the tone and the style for, "We will be a joint outfit. We will have a joint outcome." To be fair, the service chiefs were very supportive. There were struggles where there needed to be, and I always look at it, if there's no tension, no one cares. 

In some areas a lot of caring, and that just means you have to provide your value proposition to convince them it was the right thing to do. If you put that across to them and it was, even though it wasn't necessarily in their interest, they had to give something, they'd do it. The Chief of Army, the Navy and Air Force were very supportive.

That's what I liked on the journey. If you can prove your value proposition, and it makes sense, it's very hard to argue against it.

Phil Tarrant:

Well, and I'd probably argue that you're a much better diplomat now, having done that job, than going into it. To try and massage or orchestrate greater connectivity at a joint level, hopefully at a point in time that role becomes redundant and it just happens.

Warren McDonald:

Yeah, that it's just behaviour as opposed to primary thought. I saw that change, so you'd hope that would be the case. Maybe others are best to comment.

Phil Tarrant:

Comment on that. No.

Warren McDonald:

That's what I've seen, yeah.

Phil Tarrant:

We're all familiar with the evolving strategic situation for Australia, how that's playing out to the north, and that's changing things rapidly. The recent AUKUS announcement which manifests itself with the headline, which is, nuclear power submarines, but it's much broader and wider than that. No doubt within the RAAF itself, the guys and girls are getting probably more context about why they're doing it.

Warren McDonald:

Yes. 

Phil Tarrant:

Now with you at the helm of Lockheed Martin, this is changing at pace. No doubt there's a view in the US about what it means and Lockheed's role in it, and now you as the custodian of that role here. What's the initial response or reaction from Lockheed at a corporate level towards the AUKUS announcement and how do you see that playing out over the years?

Warren McDonald:

Yeah, look, a very forward leap. As soon as the AUKUS announcement was made, Lockheed and I got together and looked at, there's people focused on the nuclear submarine aspect, but there are other technologies and capabilities that were discussed, hypersonics, artificial intelligence and so forth.

Very shortly after that announcement we got together to look at how we can contribute. Lockheed Martin is about contributing to the war, fighting outcomes of Australia and it has very big, a long history of doing so, with all the capabilities that reside. Look, part of the reason I joined Lockheed Martin, actually the main reason I joined, is that Lockheed Martin holds in its hands the combat power of the Defence Force. 

Others in other companies may disagree, but I'll put forward to you, the fact that the F-35 is your air combat, air dominance platform. That the AEGIS system that will be on the Hunter class, and is on the Hobart class, is your combat system, and as long, if we are fortunate enough as a company to win Air-6500 integrated air and missile defence, it will dictate your success or otherwise in a conflict. 

Obviously, previous to that, we had the combat system on the Future submarine, so that was my driving reason. Why? Because we do hold that, and that's a responsibility Lockheed Martin takes very seriously. It's a responsibility I know the team here does. Also, I look back in my responsibility, back to an organisation such as Defence, which I was in for 41 years, I have a responsibility then to deliver and sustain that combat capability with excellence.

Phil Tarrant:

I know you've been working now with Joe North over the last couple of months, getting up to speed on the breadth of the Lockheed business in Australia. By the way, you seem pretty well across your remit here.

Warren McDonald:

I've still got some soft spots there, Phil.

Phil Tarrant:

No, but how do you go about, I guess, at a personal level, this dichotomy between inheriting programmes like the F-35, when you talk about these new opportunities for Lockheed moving forward? Is it a 50-50 split in how you approach that? Or is new business, new business development, engagement, connectivity at the fore?

Warren McDonald:

I don't think I could put it down into a split. Obviously, like I said, my commitment is to sustain with excellence and deliver with excellence. Also capture with excellence, if you want to put it in those terms. I look at it in accordance with the customer's priorities, or the priorities of Defence, and that's where I put, that we will put our efforts. 

Whether you break that up into a percentage or you just do it by commitment, our focus is to deliver the customer requirements. Then there are a lot of emerging new requirements coming out of Defence obviously, with the programmes that they have active, and we're very active in trying to support them and get the best outcome for the war fighter. You never take your eye off the capability you have resident inside Defence, so that's why we are energised to sustain that with excellence, the F-35, AEGIS and so forth.

Phil Tarrant:

You entered this role at a time when the security environment is probably very different to how it's been for your predecessor, and the AUKUS arrangement I think is indicative of that. You talk about the needs of the customer, no doubt that will change rapidly in time, as required. What's your sense for the significance of the emerging threat within the Indo-Pacific and I guess Australia's capability to respond to it? I guess connected with that, the imperative of this really tight relationship with industry to make sure they're prepared, irrespective of what's happened.

Warren McDonald:

Yeah, look, I'll leave the politics and the strategic implications for others. My place is to make sure the war fighter is equipped with what they need. Part of your question, you talk change in focus, I think the Sovereign guided weapons, RFI, which came out with a 21 day term, is a good indicator of where government is focused, and that was also part of the AUKUS announcement as well, so it backs that strategy.

We are focused on providing that response. We've provided 19 options to Defence, ranging from laser-guided bombs through to hypersonic capabilities, and our aim then is to bring that type of manufacturing and sustainer lines into Australia, should Defence and government choose to do so. 

It's important that we, with the backdrop as you articulate, that we have a very strong Sovereign capability in Australia, and that is the other reason Lockheed Martin is energised on bringing Australian companies into the Defence portfolio. Moran's, your Contunet, Silentium, Quickstep, all those who contribute quite significantly to the current programmes we have. We also have another office set up for industrial participation that looks for, and there are some very good capabilities inside Australia, bring them into a global supply chain, so they can better support.

The other part is, the capabilities of Defence have aligned quite well to the Indo-Pacific, the AEGIS class combat system runs through combat systems, obviously in the United States of America, but Japan and South Korea, as does the F-35. You start to see a great synergy in capabilities and a great strength in their cumulative power, should we ever have to respond to a government's requirement?

Phil Tarrant:

You spoke about the AEGIS system on the future frigates, can you give us an update on how that program's playing out? The boats still need to be built, it's still on your instal list and on top of it, but so how's that going?

Warren McDonald:

Well, our part of it is, we're on track. I don't know if this is the best place to discuss the entire programme, the Hobart class. I'll come back to the Hobart class, just to give you an understanding where we'll go with that, into the Hobart class, we've recently done an upgrade on the Hobart class, and that's the only one outside the United States of America that has been done.

Why was that possible? That's possible because of the investment Lockheed Martin's made in the Australian workforce, and it does have a lot of transferred skill. It has invested in the Australian workforce, to build up that capacity, so that we can truly do it on the Sovereign, and then we'll do the same for the Hobart class, we'll do the same for the 6500 should we be successful. We've already started doing that, we've taken that cost and risk, 35 combat system engineers out of a Future submarine programme and invested them straight into 6500, so that we can do that, and match the requirements that Defence will levy upon us.

Phil Tarrant:

Now, at Lockheed Martin for the last four years, with Joe north at the helm, they've decided to put North in the seat as chief executive, is that method to their madness there?

Warren McDonald:

I wouldn't call it madness. It gives you the understanding of how serious they are about Australia and investing in it. Joe, like you said, has done a tremendous effort in getting us to where we are, and mine is to keep that ship sailing in the very strong direction that he has set and move it to the future. I think with having some experience in Defence, will help me translate the requirements and provide a better understanding of where we need to go to in the future.

Phil Tarrant:

You touched on, very quickly, and I really want to drill into a little bit, this SME connectivity, defence connectivity, the big advocates of now supporting SME's into global supply chains.

Warren McDonald:

Thank you for that effort.

Phil Tarrant:

No, I think it's important, it's imperative, the whole concept of Sovereign Industrial Capabilities, to use this homegrown talent to inject it into the domestic supply chain as well as export opportunities. I remember spending some time in the States with the Lockheed team on the F-35 programme, and they spoke with reverence around the capabilities of Australian SME's supporting F-35's, your Moran's, your TAE's, and you mentioned Quickstep who makes panels for the F-35. What moving forward and no doubt, you've spoken to a lot of SME's so far and the more opportunities, the more contracts, the more opportunities, more contracts, how are you going to approach this SME engagement, now as the Chief Executive of Lockheed?

Warren McDonald:

Yeah, look, prior to taking over, I've reached out to the majority of our SME's. Why? Because it's important, and you highlight the importance. Like you said, I thank you for your work on that. It's critical that we bring them in, because they do have excellent technologies and we need to expand the base of our industry inside Australia.

I've spoken, like you said, to the Moran's, the Quicksteps, the Heat Treatment Australia's to ... I asked them directly, what are we doing that's good? What are we doing that's not so good for you? I haven't had any answers on the latter, which is nice to hear, but I can see why, given the quality of people we have involved. They're all about wanting to do more business and doing it with Lockheed Martin. They are very motivated to assist us in our endeavours, and we are to them.

We have a Protégé Programme, you're probably fully aware of that, but some of our listeners may not be. It started off in the '90s at Lockheed, and that's bringing companies who we think we can assist to get into the global supply chain, and for those who are in it, they know it's not easy. It takes it through a 12 month process, so Clearbox was one that we have done that for, and Jeremy Hallett from that company has been very complimentary. They've doubled their workforce, increased their revenue, he attributes that largely to the Protégé Programme and its focus on small and large SME's.

Phil Tarrant:

Having come out of the RAAF, 41 years, which is quite a length of service, to now jump in, smack bang in the middle of the defence industry, defence contracting, anything that's really taken you by surprise, what you didn't think would be the way it is? Or, no doubt you had a lot of relationships with the defence industry prior too, so it's a nice apprenticeship into it, but anything that's really caught you off guard?

Warren McDonald:

Not that caught me off guard. I've always liked the whole defence industry space. I guess you might put it as probably a comfortable set of clothes. The industry leans on every word that Defence says, and that's why it's important to keep those open lines of communication. I know Tony Fraser and his team do a good job of that. Tony's very much into communicating with these units, it's that critical. Because most of the listeners will be aware that, if you are looking at trying to get involved in a project, you do expend an enormous amount of internal revenue to do so, and it may not come off.

The more you know about a programme, the better off you are able to assist Defence in its outcomes. I know Tony Fraser's is doing more and more of that, to increase that level of communication. I underestimated just how much the industry depends upon it.

Phil Tarrant:

Having navigated the defence industry myself for some time now, I think the 2016 White Paper was a catalyst for promoting cultural change and the relationship between the Department of Defence, which informed public service and the defence industry. Everyone I talk to says, "It's a much better environment than what it used to be, it's far more collegiate."

Whether that's structural changes, which were necessary, or whether it's just the imperative of the environment that we're operating in right now. What do you think you will do within Lockheed Martin to keep championing this connectivity within the defence industry, but also back to the customer, in their ever-needing changes?

Warren McDonald:

Yeah, look, if you talk it, then you've got to walk it, and that's shown by my priority in talking to our suppliers. I'm a bit, pretty hardcore. If you criticise someone for not doing something, you never do yourself, so that's why I reached out to them, get that level of communication going, so that I can better understand what problems they're facing and how we can assist.

Then, for me, engaging with Defence, understanding whether we're delivering as required, what changes we need to make, and keeping that communication level going. That also includes Ministers, so obviously their portfolios are incredibly important and it's up to us to be responsible to that requirement. Phil, it's all about communication and teamwork, that's what it all comes down to. 

Phil Tarrant:

Yeah, it sounds simple, doesn't it? Simple and easy.

Warren McDonald:

Yeah, but not necessarily.

Phil Tarrant:

Not always the way. One of the challenges we have, I think with defence industry, is attracting and retaining the talent. One of the great benefits of capable people going through the ADF, there's a nice home for them in the defence industry when they choose to leave service. That's a great pool of new people in the industry, but no doubt, like every other prime and every other SME, you've got this war for talent, trying to find the right people do the right job. How are you going about making sure Lockheed Martin's an attraction business for those people looking for maybe a career change or an industry change? 

Warren McDonald:

Yeah, look, it's something that faces every industry. Even, trying to get crops off fields at the moment, everything's complex, just given the constraints we have. Obviously government's very active in that space to alleviate that, but on our level and we're responsible as well, investing in STEM programmes regionally, all the way through to a national level. National would be the National Youth Science Forum, we're engaged with Melanie Bagg to go down, engaging with that forum.

Whilst we focus on STEM, we also have experts in the technical fields, back to the tools that I was used to, with Sikorsky in Yarra, where we have our apprenticeship scheme. We have 200 employees out there, we're very focused on the Shoalhaven region. We employ young apprentices as they can gain a profession and trade through their life skills. 

In some of those areas of Shoalhaven, there's certainly high unemployment rates, but we're offering high value employment through aviation industries, such as working on the helicopter for the Navy.

Phil Tarrant:

That's one of the reasons why I do enjoy recording podcasts and being quite good to diarize, COVID 19, in the voice of the defence industry. A lot of people have found it tough. How have you found the SME supply channel? I'll close this chat. How have they navigated COVID? It's been largely okay, it's buttressed a little bit inside Defence?

Warren McDonald:

Yeah, look, you can't fault anyone for committing to it, and in the vagaries that COVID-19 has thrown up. It's been a collective effort to move through it all. Defence, government, or, states, territories, everybody, all industries have been focused on it. Why? Because they understand the importance of it.

I think, I'm thankful the government had that focus on our Australian industry capability well before COVID hit them, so I think in many ways that's assisted us. Globally, it's been a large impact, it's driven a lot of complications for programmes. The F-35 is an example of that, we've been constrained in delivery, although it will quickly recover. The F-35's due to COVID, no-one's been immune to it , if you put it in those terms, yeah.

Phil Tarrant:

We spoke about inflexion points, going from an apprentice motor transport fitter to a pilot, and now to Chief of Joint Capabilities. The inflexion point must have been, "Okay, that's time to leave the uniform, it's time to join Defence." Is there any specific moment that said, "Now it's time?" Or was it just one of the natural things that happened?

Warren McDonald:

Well, a few may not know, but when you go through the star rank, it goes a little bit like this, "Well, congratulations on your promotion. Have you thought about leaving the Defence Force?" Why is it like that? It's like that, it comes back to your point about throughput, because you can't stay in Defence at those levels for too long, otherwise you stop exceptional talent, and the Defence Force has exceptional talent in it. It is on the shoulders of those in the senior leadership positions to have a timeline stamped for their departure.

Phil Tarrant:

Warren McDonald, Chief Executive of Australia Lockheed Martin, thanks for your time today.

Warren McDonald:

You're welcome, Phil, thank you.

Phil Tarrant:

I hope you enjoyed that everyone. Remember to check out defenceconnect.com.au. On social media, you can find us at Defence Connect, if that's how you like to get your information. We'll see you next time, until then, bye-bye.